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Erik Hoel's avatar

Thanks Julian for spending time grappling with the paper!

However, this objection doesn't work. Mostly because unlike what you claim, the paper does not define substitutions as having to be actually physically constructible! Why? Because this would be a severe handicap for science and neuter our notions of falsification.

Imagine the equivalent: “Ah, we can clearly mathematically define a hypothetical machine that would falsify general relativity. But don’t worry! It would just be too big to ever physically build. Therefore, we don’t need to worry about this machine that would disprove general relativity, because we can never get the resources to build it.” You see how that sounds? You should hear this and immediately start thinking that general relatively must be wrong and start looking for alternatives. A resource-constrained notion of scientific falsifiability is a very bad one!

And there’s an even further part to the paper that this objection also misses, which is a big oversight, since it's one of the reasons this paper is so complicated: lookup tables are just one extreme example of a substitution and the whole paper proceeds by proving the equivalency of *other* substitutions to them, forming a chain that leads up to LLMs. That's the whole point of the Proximity Argument and why all those theorems for it exist. So yes, at the *bottom* of the chain you have a lookup table that's not physically constructible due to resource constraints, but the links of the chain prove the equivalency all the way down. And there are a number of already existing proofs in the literature that I use to show this equivalency.

Via the earlier analogy, it’s like saying “this machine disproves general relativity, but we can’t build it because it requires too many resources… but look, it’s equivalent to another machine that is easier to construct, and it has the same issues… and look, that’s equivalent to another machine that’s even easier to construct….” And so on. That's what this paper is doing.

Again, I appreciate you grappling with the paper, but the paper is structured such that people have to give up a lot to escape the trap. Here, you're subtly giving up a a broad notion of scientific falsification to escape and switching to a very narrow one that seems obviously unworkable if you think through it. And furthermore, this objection doesn't grapple with, e.g., the proofs about the single-hidden-layer feedforward neural networks, or the shortest program stuff, which could all be used in lieu of lookup tables.

I also think this is a conceptual issue about why and how this disproof works. Lookup tables are just very useful because they are conceptually so simple, so it's easy to see that any non-trivial and falsifiable theory of consciousness couldn't apply to a lookup table. It's less "The argument is based on lookup tables" and more "the argument uses lookup tables because they are clean and easy to think about."

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